A question for all tattoo artists --> plz read

i did a search for the picture but couldn't find it. my friend has the pic. anywho, it's a question for all tat artists out there and even on here. Have you ever refused to even draw something for someone becuase it went against your religion? My friend has been trying to get this design he wants drawn up for the past 5 yrs. Yes, he wants it tattooed on him, but for the past 5 yrs, all the places he's been, no one has agreed to even draw it for him becuase they said it went against their religious beliefs. The design is simple. It comes from Alchemy. There are some Runes in the piece, a pentagram, a euroboris (sorry, i can not spell this correctly). A euroboris is the ring (circle) on the outside of the pentagram. The pentagram tips (points) touch the circle. Inside the euroboris circle he wants 2 dragons w/ serpent like bodies, one dragon on top w/ wings, feet out, (1 slightly tucked in) and this one is wearing a crown , colored in red/black,this one has its mouth kinda eating the 2nd dragons tail... it meets like that in the circle. The 2nd dragon is not wearing a crown, but it is in a black and white, almost a black and gray shade. My friend is not satanic, he is pagan, and he studies theology. However all the tat artists he's brought the design too said they will not draw it or ink it cuase it goes against their religion. I've seen the design. It's a very simple drawing. the detailed part is the dragons... I could draw this thing... i'd need help on the dragons, but i could do it... anywho, I'm Catholic (Christian), i've seen tons of pentagrams in my life... I've seen the Wicca stuff, the new age, satanic stuff, etc... i don't see what would stop me from drawing this up. Now i'm not a religious fanatic. Another tat artist in the OK area, we were telling this too, and he asked why the artists he had asked would say that? he said, the bible says "Do not mark the body."... so i'm just wondering, if it was you that had this design brought to you, would you refuse too? and if so, why? there's got to be reasons behind this.... if i get a pic of this from my friend, i'll post it up here, or if i find one online.

I don't see why most artists wouldn't do this tattoo...I don't believe that your frind tried too hard or he would have found someone

well, he was stationed in Germany for a long time... and he is now w/ me in Sill... he said he never found anyone who would do it for him... I found him someone last night who would do it. So his search is over. But still what do the rest of you think about this? and by the way, here's a lil info on the Orobourous: http://articles.theotaku.com/view.php?action=retrieve&id=917 still looking for a pic for you..

oh and trust me taz, he looked...

As a consciencous Tattoo Artist with over 40 years in the Art and a concious, I wouldn't have any problem doing that tattoo and I was raised Catholic, I don't "practice' but I sure remember what I was taught. Could be part of the problem is some folfs don't understand the difference between Wicca and witchcraft and/or confuse it with Satanism, which, incidently, it is not. I'm not too sure that I agree with you that it's a 'simple design', not with the various things described being done with decent detail (Would like to see the design, then could be more specific) but I still think it could be done and wonder what the problem is. Oh, I"m not one of those assholes who will do anything for the buck or even anything that a person says they want, I refuse a decent amount of money having principles and respect for my art. Where the heck are you located, by the way?...Doc

Doc.. for a personal reference.. there is no difference between Wicca and witchcraft.. Wiccans practice witchcraft..

haha...if you wanna break it down, there's really not much difference in most religions.

This is very true..

Destined, for your information, there are a lot of various practises of what is called 'witchcraft', Wicca is only one (an ancient one, if not the first) but not the 'only'. Do some real research, I think you might find some of it rather interesting, while some of it is a lot more bizzarre. Also realize different people have their own concepts of what they think 'witchcraft is/means, some don't really have a clue as to what they are talking about, as in most things, I guess...Doc

Doc.. I've been practicing various forms of witchcraft for almost 7 years.. believe me when I say I've done research.. what I meant.. was Wicca is witchcraft.. sorry for the misunderstanding..

I wanna do a witch.... OOPS!!! I meant I wanna BE a witch!! Damn Freudian slips!

Gotta love 'em.. don'tcha.. those slips.. that is.. nevermind.. Cheers?

so is the like geometry here? a rectangle is a square, but a square is not a rectangle....aka, wicca is witchcraft but witchcraft is not wicca?...sounds logical enough to me. haha.

Think ISTEP.. wait.. CAT.. you know.. those BS standardized tests you have to take in school.. anyway.. Wicca is witchcraft.. but witchcraft is not exclusively Wiccan.. yeah? k...

Yep, that pretty well explains it, simply put...Doc

i dont know of any shops ive been to that wont do religious tattoos. Most shops wont do racist tattoos. i know i wont. Jake Noury (the rorkiteer) will not tattoo anything against god, jesus, or defiling women.

I can see how some very devote christians (or anyone fanatically devote to their faith, no matter what it may be) wouldn't do a tattoo from another religion because they truely believe it is misinformed at the least and horribly evil at the worst. I can't see too many tattoo artists out there like that though. I think a big part of the business is having the ability to be empathetic about where someone is coming from. A bible thumping tattoo artist would have a very limited clientel. And just because the "religion and hereditary tattoos ARE racial tattoos" arguement is going to come up again, let me say that although they both share a similar vibrant passion, they come from opposite ends of the emotional spectrum. Loving your own spirituality and background is one thing; being bent on hate about someone else's is a whole other matter.

I can see how some very devote christians (or anyone fanatically devote to their faith, no matter what it may be) wouldn't do a tattoo from another religion because they truely believe it is misinformed at the least and horribly evil at the worst. I can't see too many tattoo artists out there like that though. I think a big part of the business is having the ability to be empathetic about where someone is coming from. A bible thumping tattoo artist would have a very limited clientel. And just because the "religion and hereditary tattoos ARE racial tattoos" arguement is going to come up again, let me say that although they both share a similar vibrant passion, they come from opposite ends of the emotional spectrum. Loving your own spirituality and background is one thing; being bent on hate about someone else's is a whole other matter.

I 've seen the mindset you're talking about, Lillian.. I find that's really sad. I'm not a tattoo artist, but I did some thinking about the topic when I considered apprenticing. I guess to have some "answers ready" for the inevitable questions: As a Christian, its NOT my place to attack others' choice of belief. It would be infringing on THEIR freedom to refuse a certain tattoo...and Christianity isn't about forcing my beliefs on people (The Crusades weren't my fault :P) Sure, that stuff may not be my favorite thing to draw up or do, but that would apply to a lot of less artistically interesting material as well. Could I stretch that to say "hate material is none of my business" either? Well, its really not! But the implications of having my name attached to that work and being seen as actively promulgating those things... there's no way I'd take that chance.

i hate hate

doc, i'm located in what i like to call Ft. Hell. but it's Ft. Sill, Oklahoma...