gun or machine?

Ok whats up? Should we just let it go when its called a "GUN....maybe I'm makin too much of it. When I was apprenticing I was taught that using the correct terminology was essential and that it dishonored this age old profession to do otherwise. Am I just an old fart and mired in the past or should we use the proper terminology? My mentor fined us $50 when we were caught using the term "gun" It has been my experience , and that of many others that ,in general people who call it a "gun" are one of two types...#1...those not involved in the art and have the excuse of lack of knowledge...#2...Amateurs who know just enough to be dangerous and shouldn't be allowed to play with sharp objects. So all you out there in tattoo land let me know your thoughts!! Especially Joe C,Krystoff, Gabe, Erlich and all the regulars who give us soooo much insight on this site! Thanks to all...Taz

Oh yeah...Skittlez too...Can't forget Skittlez!!

IM of the opinion that you can tell quite a bit about how serious a person is by the words they choose to use when talking about a tattoo, and the business. Someone wanting to know where they can buy a gun to do some tat's, cause he thinks he'd be good at it. Is someone I'll choose to ignore, or berate. If your serious about the craft than learn the lingo. Know what the F%#K your talking about before you step up to the plate. We've all used the proper terminology here on the board in several posts. Problem is most only understand what they think they need to get ahead. And choose to ignore the pearls of wisdom left behind by most of us. So step on up to the plate stupid, just don't get pissed at us when ya get knocked senseless by a wild pitch cause ya forgot to where that whatcha call it, Hat thingy... JOE

Thanks Joe...you always seem to be the voice of reason and intelligence...That is unless ya disagree with me!! TEE HEE!...OK come on where are the rest of ya?

Excellent points brought up by Joe, in addition I'd like to toss my beans into the mix; "Guns don't kill people, Bad Tattoo Artists Kill People"

dude ive got 23 tats and my guy has mad guns... just kidding i like to think of myself as being tattooed or quite heavily tattooed at this point and the word machine was drilled into my head the first or second day of my apprenticeship. fortunately i didnt go to long making picking up bad habits. am i the only person that cringes when they hear someone say gun?

Im not a tattoo artist so my choice of words is probably irrelevant, but every-time the apprentice at our shop asks how to do something to his guns we all cringe and shiver and wonder how long it will take to get that horrible word out of his vocabulary. $50 fines sound good to me... Its pretty simple to me, guns are for shooting and tattoo machines are for tattooing...

" Calling a tattoo machine a gun is like calling your mother a whore" I cant remember who said that but I never forgot it. Nick

"It is a lesser crime to call your mother a whore and your father a theif than to call the sacred machine of tattooing a GUN". By the Worlds Oldest Living Tattoo Artist (that I am proud to call friend...Jack Armstrong...Taz

I thought artists were supposed to be opened minded and into free speech and so on. Yes, I am the apprentice who keeps calling it a gun. primarily because I use a 'screw gun' all day in my other life as a carpenter. It's my personal opinion that we all let it go. I certainly don't meen to offend anyone, least of all my friend Gabe, but it is just a word. Leave the sensoring for the Republicans Ryan

Your right, with all the other shit going on in the world I dont suppose it really matters.................................. But I will say this, Dont get confused and take your tat iron hunting coz you wont hit anything. Likewise dont take your 12 gauge to work or people will get the wrong idea! Nick

Lets not confuse protecting free speech and mis-speech! :-) Im not one to really judge someone's english, though, I suck at it! I have found that hands down professional tattoo artists call their tools machines though...

Hey man, you gotta start calling yer screw gun a screw machine for a month at work... heh.

I think I rattled a hornets nest... I've made the executyive decision to call it a machine. Ryan

Thats a good idea, I think I might put up like a swear jar, for those who call my machines a "gun" , a dollar a pop, or something, what do you think?

good decision ryan. you will sound much more professional when using the proper terms for our equipment. you will also get a little more recognition when talking to other professionals.

Just so it's clear... I'm not even into guns. I've been a bowhunter most of my hunting life. I sold all the guns years ago after picking up my first bow. My use, ..or misuse of the word 'gun', comes from being in an environment far removed from tattooing. I am new to this and I really did not mean to offend anyone. I hope to learn from this forum not alienate myself. Ry

don't worry ryan, as part of your apprenticeship, i will break you of that habbit like a horse.

I have read an heard alot of people bitching about calling a tatto machine a gun. Does anyone maybe know who originally got so picky about the terms for a tool. I was a mechanic for 3 and a half years and one thing I learned was that all kinds of people call things by an improper term, ie motor for engine, thingy for a spark plug, whatchamawhogitfor a crankshaft, dilly bobber, ect. and as a mechanic I never complained nor did I ever hear other mechanics complaine about using the wrong term. So, why all the fuss in this industry? Tattoos are not for yuppie dicks so why are artists so snobby about this? PS: Not meaning to step on toes just never understood why artists make such a deal about such a common mistake.

perhaps in the automotive industry, parts and tools get called the wrong thing because nobody ever corrects the person making the mistake ?? is it possible that master certified mechanics do frown upon the same thing in a world full of backyard mechanics doing half assed work for top notch pay? I'm not implying anything, just taking your comparison of the 2 fields to the next step.

i'd rather recieve a great piece of art with a gun, than a shitty tatt with a machine. who really cares. getting fined for calling a glorified, modified, doorbell a gun sounds military. like most artists i know, i don't like undo authority. i don't think we need to have some kind of mystic respect for a piece of metal. its the tattooer behind the machinegun that really counts. i get more upset at flash tattooers who dare to call themselves tattoo artists.

I like the response about old mechanics verses shade tree mechanics, but you are wrong about old master mechanics. They don't really care because they like most people know that depending on where your from and who taught you, you might call alot of things different names. I think that the term gun for a machine is the same for most people. Also a master artist should not have to worry about what someone thinks of thier language but rather what people think of his/her art. It's the same way for mechanics and most long lived professions that are passed down. Your work tells someone how good you are not how spiffy you speak. A handful of picky people decide on occasion that thier term for a device or a part is better than someone elses and starts ragging on everyone who calls that thing by a different name. In essence it's arrogance pure and simple.

But for someone insisting on referering to it as a "gun", they are just spitting out tattoo slang, and throughout history, people that insist on using slang instead of proper terminology don't get taken as serious as those who do, whether its tattooing or most other professions. Can you imagine a doctor going on an interview saying "yo, Ima cut that muthafucka open and tayke that canca shit outa his punk azz"? How serious do you think he'll be taken?

CALLING A TATTOO MACHINE A GUN IS LIKE CALLING YOUR MOTHER A WHORE, NOT DONE IN THE TATTOOING WORLD. I AM OLD SCHOOL AND THATS WHAT I WAS TAUGHT . I HAVE BEEN TATTOOING FOR 16 YEARS THANKS FOR LETTING ME VENT .

crackbaby...I don't think any of us that are actually in the business give a flyin fuck what anyone calls it....this forum is about educating and when people are offended by the beliefs of the true professionals then isn't there something wrong with that picture? I find it odd that so many people on this site ask for information and if the answer does not suit them they get their fur ruffled It is readily apparent that a blazing majority of the pros believe that machine is the proper term The use of the term "gun" has been and always will be a sure sign of ignorance....but then again they say that ignorance is bliss....and there are a lot of very happy fuckers out there!!...Taz

well somebody chew my ass for being away for a while just had a lot on my plate and still do but heres what my PERSONAL OPION IS. to be called a gun in america is obsered and not proper.infact it wont get you a position with me if you come to me and say i tattoo with a gun.when i was apprenticing i called them thar machines guns.well that was put to a halt fast.my mentor told me calling a mechanical machine a gun is just flat out ignorant and insulting.if i hear you call them gun 1 more time you will run around the shop naked for 15 minutes with a machine in your hand and scream this is my macine and this is my gun ( as i would grab my pecker) this is for tattoing and this is for fun.i wished not to run around in that manner and ever since then not even my kids call them guns.but on the other hand across the pond over in the europe area they do infact call them guns and do not have a problem with it like us americans do.i feel that is a educational matter and a sign of proper eticute when the MACHINE IS adressed as a machine and not GUN!

this is how it was put to me !! IT IS A LESSER CRIME TO CALL ONES MOTHER A WHORE ,THAN IT IS TO CALL THE SACRED TOOL OF TATTOOING , A GUN!!

Believe that shit. Thats just the way it is. If you're still running around calling our machines 'guns', thats cool. Just KNOW that noones who takes tattooing seriously is going to pay you any mind if you come in using that term. There are thousands of different tattooists all with their own identical styles and procedures, but one thing we all try to agree on and keep sacred are the terms in which we call our equipment. Hell, i hardly took the guy who taught me seriously because he called his machines 'guns'... and still does

I Like Tommy's (vice president of Papillon) take on this gun-machine situation. First he built the Tommy gun....then the 38 special. (BOTH nice machines) Its nice to have a sence of humor in this industry.

No problem calling those two "GUNS" huh? LOL!!!

For you guys who think I'm getting mad or something, please don't take my comment the wrong way. I have been told over and over "that's just how it is" and that "calling a machine a gun is like calling your mother a whore", and I accept that as the american standard for proper tattoo eticut. My thing is who started calling it a machine and when did the classic "seedy" nature of the tattoo and the tattoo experience. I do however agree that you should use the proper terminology for the sake of advancing the public opinion of the tattoo industry. I am more interested in the reasoning behind deciding on the term machine. For those who talk about the "sacred" tattoo machine. The only way for me to look at a tool as sacred is for it to have a history and as short of a time as the machined tattoo has been around what makes it sacred. Maybe the art is sacred and the old traditional techniques are sacred but not the machine.

What makes it sacred?Maybe the thousands of wonderful colorful souls who have devoted their lives to the art lovingly produced by these machines.Maybe the millions of tattooed people who devoted their skin to this our art.It is not just the machine that is sacred to me it is the "Church of the Colored People", that is those of us ,artist or collector or both, who worship the "Gods of the Rainbow"...Those of us who have sacrificed for this our art....those who have chosen to forego at one time or another the sad "neccessities "so to speak, of life ,like eating regularly, to save money for that next piece.....Like so many of us who have been sorely judged to be lacking in moral turpitude by the "Blanks of our world only because of the colors embedded in our skins.We choose not to be bullied by a judgemental society...to never conform...we choose this our sacred art above what others consider "acceptable" We choose to be a part of this sacred ritual of reds and blues and grays and lines and shadow...We will never consider this art just a "passing fad" as so many have done and still do....this art is so much more than a passing fancy to a legion of we, the priests and priestesses of the needle Am I making any sense to you unbelievers? I speak not of a simple idea or belief...instead I speak of a way of life!... Please realize that my comments are metaphorical in nature and accept them and hopefully appreciate them as such. Sacred machine?...you are damn right its sacred in the ..right and proper hands my friend...Taz the Longwinded!!!

Beautiful thoughts there Taz.

Think yew berry berry much ...Tat2 has been berry berry gud to 2 me.......T

By the way who cares...I care who are ya???????? are u an artiste? If so where do ya work...inquiring mind and all that LOL!!!!!