GUNS!!!!!

Justice john paul jones and steven beyer took a load on the chin today in hand gun ban vote!...and its about time those judges in the supreme court got something right. Thank God those pricks were in the minority because its our right as individual citizens to have those in our homes for protection. Suck a fat one assholes!

Some people are really not responsibly enough to have guns. Some people are not responsible enough to own a car let alone a gun. Gun control should be tighter.

fuck your attitude towards guns. thats why they have backround checks retard. its not the fault of responsible gun owners for the tragic school shootings or the stupid ass people living in abbott districts who obtain guns illegally THEN shoot a rival gang member over a corner block or 20 worth of drugs. those fucktards give responsible gun owners a bad name. its like the teachers that continually fuck their students. they give the good and great teachers an aweful rap. go fuck yourself.

a second thought to your irrational point of having tighter gun control. thieves and all around horrible people are still going to get ahold of guns illegally whether you make "gun control" tighter or not. all gun control does is further disarm good responsible people who want a gun for HOME protection, sport, and/or hunting. my point is you'll make it harder for people to protect themselves against assholes making america MORE dangerous....you dip shit.

You're a prime example of a complete prick I'm talking about. The combination of your attitude and guns is a recipe for disaster. People like you really should NOT even be allowed in society. I can tell by your prose you have not been brought up well. Why do you need a gun to get it up? Fucking lame fuck. Utter wanker.

HA....you dont know me asshole. To be frankly honest with you i'm a chemist at one of the governments largest manufacturers of weapons so fuck off. I just get irritated with liberal pricks like you who only want criminals and the government to have guns. What does that leave the responsible people of this world to protect themselves with? Guns are a right given to us by the second amendment in the constitution...end of story. Why are people like you all for gun control? Should we have tighter restrictions on our first amendment rights too? hey fuck it...we'll just start taking away the whole fucking constitution slowly until barack hussein obama makes america a communist country just like china. you are uneducated about our nations constitution. i suggest you study up before coming on here and talking your nonsense.

Does anyone ever notice that when leftists have nothing of substance to say they resort to name calling? Let me ask you something. Who the hell do you think you are to tell me I should not be able to have a gun to defend myself? What happens when a psychotic killer breaks into my house who outweighs me (I am a female by the way)? Should I just let him rape, torture, and strangle me? Or, should I have the option to grab my gun and shoot him? Yeah sure, I could call the cops... but I'd be dead before they got there. Maybe if you read your history you would know that tyranny also starts by taking away individual's guns. When Hitler took power (who was popularly voted in) he sent his militia to everyone's house to confiscate their guns "for the common good." Only one town in Poland said screw you and kept their guns and shot at the militia. After all of the guns were taken, here comes Hitler's military to kill who ever they wanted. Maybe you should go back and actually READ the Constitution and other work by the framers. They specifically wanted to make sure the individuals never had their arms taken away in fear of tyranny. It happened to them with Great Britain and they did not want it to happen again. As Thomas Jefferson, the smartest man in the world once said, "when a government becomes tyrannical, the people must overthrow it." I'm so sick of this "blame America, hate America" attitude. This is the greatest country to live in and I feel blessed to have been born here.

Does anyone ever notice that when leftists have nothing of substance to say they resort to name calling? Let me ask you something. Who the hell do you think you are to tell me I should not be able to have a gun to defend myself? What happens when a psychotic killer breaks into my house who outweighs me (I am a female by the way)? Should I just let him rape, torture, and strangle me? Or, should I have the option to grab my gun and shoot him? Yeah sure, I could call the cops... but I'd be dead before they got there. Maybe if you read your history you would know that tyranny also starts by taking away individual's guns. When Hitler took power (who was popularly voted in) he sent his militia to everyone's house to confiscate their guns "for the common good." Only one town in Poland said screw you and kept their guns and shot at the militia. After all of the guns were taken, here comes Hitler's military to kill who ever they wanted. Maybe you should go back and actually READ the Constitution and other work by the framers. They specifically wanted to make sure the individuals never had their arms taken away in fear of tyranny. It happened to them with Great Britain and they did not want it to happen again. As Thomas Jefferson, the smartest man in the world once said, "when a government becomes tyrannical, the people must overthrow it." I'm so sick of this "blame America, hate America" attitude. This is the greatest country to live in and I feel blessed to have been born here.

Does anyone ever notice that when leftists have nothing of substance to say they resort to name calling? Let me ask you something. Who the hell do you think you are to tell me I should not be able to have a gun to defend myself? What happens when a psychotic killer breaks into my house who outweighs me (I am a female by the way)? Should I just let him rape, torture, and strangle me? Or, should I have the option to grab my gun and shoot him? Yeah sure, I could call the cops... but I'd be dead before they got there. Maybe if you read your history you would know that tyranny also starts by taking away individual's guns. When Hitler took power (who was popularly voted in) he sent his militia to everyone's house to confiscate their guns "for the common good." Only one town in Poland said screw you and kept their guns and shot at the militia. After all of the guns were taken, here comes Hitler's military to kill who ever they wanted. Maybe you should go back and actually READ the Constitution and other work by the framers. They specifically wanted to make sure the individuals never had their arms taken away in fear of tyranny. It happened to them with Great Britain and they did not want it to happen again. As Thomas Jefferson, the smartest man in the world once said, "when a government becomes tyrannical, the people must overthrow it." I'm so sick of this "blame America, hate America" attitude. This is the greatest country to live in and I feel blessed to have been born here.

http://www.courierpostonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080627/NEWS01/806270357&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL Here is a prime example of what i'm talking about. Jesmond do you know where Camden, NJ is? If you do then you know that you are literally taking your life into your own hands going there after dark. I live in a different township 15 minutes away but do not go to camden. HOWEVER there is nothing in the world to stop them from coming to my neighborhood and breaking into my house. Are you saying that i shouldn't be able to freely and legally obtain a license to have a gun to protect my wife and house? OR should I do the liberal thing and let them rape my wife, shoot us when they are through and take the things that WE'VE bought and worked so hard for? Your a dumb ass who obviously doesn't know the constitution very well and the meaning of WHY we have it. Camden murder rates are up 81%.....i'll say it again...81% from this same exact time last year. How many of those murders do you think were committed with an ILLEGAL guns? I'll tell you....mostly all you know why? NONE of those murders were an act of self defense. Want to know why that is? NJ CITIZENS ARE STRIPPED OF THEIR RIGHTS TO CARRY CONCEALED WEAPONS LEGALLY!!! If this poor man had one he may be alive today and not a mere memory in the newspaper. He was walking to his house late at night after working at his second job. He did not deserve to die this way.

Does anyone ever notice that when leftists have nothing of substance to say they resort to name calling? Let me ask you something. Who the hell do you think you are to tell me I should not be able to have a gun to defend myself? What happens when a psychotic killer breaks into my house who outweighs me (I am a female by the way)? Should I just let him rape, torture, and strangle me? Or, should I have the option to grab my gun and shoot him? Yeah sure, I could call the cops... but I'd be dead before they got there. Maybe if you read your history you would know that tyranny also starts by taking away individual's guns. When Hitler took power (who was popularly voted in) he sent his militia to everyone's house to confiscate their guns "for the common good." Only one town in Poland said screw you and kept their guns and shot at the militia. After all of the guns were taken, here comes Hitler's military to kill who ever they wanted. Maybe you should go back and actually READ the Constitution and other work by the framers. They specifically wanted to make sure the individuals never had their arms taken away in fear of tyranny. It happened to them with Great Britain and they did not want it to happen again. As Thomas Jefferson, the smartest man in the world once said, "when a government becomes tyrannical, the people must overthrow it." I'm so sick of this "blame America, hate America" attitude. This is the greatest country to live in and I feel blessed to have been born here.

OH HERE IS ANOTHER ONE....how about those 3 or 4 college bound kids in Newark, NJ who were shot behind a school on their knees execution style by 6 illegal immigrants? Look up that story and tell me what MAY HAVE happened if they had a permit to carry a LEGALLY concealed weapon. They were literally just hanging out minding their own business and some fuckin foreigner who had gang ties decided he wanted to just shoot some innocent people. You are the one(s), jesmond and all your little liberal minded wackos, who need to wake the fuck up. All us "psycopaths" want to do is legally exercise our CONSTITUTIONAL right to PROTECT ourselves....not go on shooting sprees just because. I'm a hard working professional and have to much to lose by living the "gangster" lifestyle.

Seriously, brown wilson. Do you really think that just because there is a ban guns that criminals will abide by it? They don't obey any other laws, what makes u think they will obey this? They will laugh at us. Remember those churches that were getting robbed? They knew you couldn't have a gun in church so BINGO, they went aruond and robbed a bunch. BUT, one church had a woman who was a security guard in there and she had a gun.. when they came to rob that church, she shot him and saved the day. No one got robbed, no innocent people got harmed. More people die in car crashes than in accidental shootings, should we outlaw driving too?

and i realize that one of my posts posted like 4 times....... i hit the refresh button and that's what happened...

seriously.

heller vs. DC. another ironic point to be made. Washington DC banned ownership of (hand)guns some 30 years ago yet murder rates seemed to still increased. Isn't it wierd that the policy of "no one should be allowed to have handguns at all for any purpose except for the police" still allowed for murders to happen? Why do you think that is? Could it be that criminals still got ahold of illegal guns to enforce their robberies? No thats impossible right because it was a blanket policy and no one had guns? So I wonder how the murder rate still climbed. I guess we'll never know huh jesmond. IF you make something illegal it just magically goes away right? You know no one smokes pot because thats illegal. America has ZERO heroin addicts as well. What world do you people live in. Do you people who love to throw around the word "gun control" live in reality? OH and theres no illegal foreigners here in America either because its illegal to cross borders and sneak into America. I'm pretty sure EVERYONE goes through the legal process to get here. dipshits. The world needs more courageous people like David Heller to "FUCK YOU" to this rediculous government that is running this GREAT country right into the fucking ground by legislating their own personal interests.

First off Blee - "I hate this blame America, hate America attitude" nobody said that so don't turn this into something that it's not. Second Hairpie, you are not correct. If I lived in an area where I had to protect my wife and home with a gun I would seriously think about moving, by your own admission you're a professional and have just boasted about your job and position within a certain company, therefore I would have thought you'd have both the means and common sense to turn a bad situation around - remember you are just the one who admitted you felt it necessary to protect your wife and home with a gun so don't even try and reply with - well it's not too bad after all. The same goes to blee. Both of you just try to see who can shout the loudest to make your point. Also blee this isn't a history lesson, you agree with guns, I do not, simple. I can tell you're immature because you try to change the subject to make your point. Just because other things are illegal doesn't make it ok. There are very few people who can actually justify owning a gun for a real purpose. Most people, and that's usually young men, do because they think it makes them look hard and to give them a sense of power, fact not fiction, and that's pathetic. Blee you're a complete tool with no life experience and hairpie you suck cock and like boys with guns, go and watch yourself in the mirror pulling your trigger, yes you know you've done that, wank bag.

Hahaha, Again, I state... whenever leftists have nothing of substance to say, they resort to name calling. I am immature, but who is the one that has to sit here and call people names?? Sorry that I know a thing or two about this country. I wasn't giving you a history lesson, but guess what?? That's where all of these laws and bans come from... HISTORY. And that Supreme Court ruling yesterday is a part of HISTORY. I didn't change any subject. I was talking about the Constitution and how they PROTECT our natural born rights from the government, ie gun rights. You don't know me at all, so to sit here and tell me I have no life experience is judgmental and IMMATURE. Oh, but that's right.. the people who preach tolerance and being open-minded are the most intolerant and close-minded people. You can never have an open debate with people such as yourself without attacking people personally. Grow up.

Also, how do you know what most people have guns for? Did you survey everyone who owns a gun?? Sorry buddy, but MOST people who own guns do so for hunting, collecting, and/or protection. It is the minority of gangs and criminals who do it to look "hard." I would think being a person who leans to the left, you would be less likely to jump conclusions and judge people like that. But your answer to everything is just to ban it. And that's funny you should say that just because criminals will still get guns doesn't mean you shouldn't it. First of all, if all of them have guns how are you going to protect yourself? Second of all, you are the same people that turn around say "well teenagers are going to have sex anyway, so let's just give them birth control and condoms! As long as they're being safe!" Such hypocrisy.

Blee, yet again and again we must go round in circles because you are not all there. Who said anything about banning guns? Tighter controls are what I said - please don't try to put words in my mouth because you are on the defensive. This isn't a conversation about history or guns in history or any part of that, it's a conversation about whether there should be tighter controls or not, please don't disguise the topic to suit your needs. As for name calling I'm only giving back what hairpie thought necessary to dish out in the first place - that much I think you can see? And as you firmly agree with - I have the right to defend myself -one of your beliefs if I'm not mistaken. Just to add to that, the name calling you dislike so much - you've just responded to name calling by, indeed, name calling. Does that not actually make you the hypocrite? Also I have not done a survey in America regarding guns control, or lack of it, by your very indication it looks like you have? I would hope so after you just slated me on the subject, can you display your findings for us all to see? Somehow I think not. On this one we'll have to agree to disagree. But seriously if you live in a place where you do feel the need to protect yourself/property etc with a gun I strongly suggest trying to improve your life for your own benefit. It would be very interesting to see how you live in real life, I somehow doubt your circumstance are that dire, but hey, what do I know?

Just to add to that what are you going on about babies and condoms, who said anything about that? I suppose this is another example of you not changing the subject again. I'm sorry but it's very much when it suits with you.

hahahaha....if you are feeding off my "name calling" then why dont you direct that towards me and not other people on this post. I guess you think you really socked it to me with that comment about me liking to suck cock and play with little boys...WOW ya did. So where are your stats that say that an arbitrary group of "some" people shouldn't be allowed to own guns. Is this a survey that you did? Who deems it appropriate for someone to have a gun. Like i previously stated in this very post IF "gun control" was tighter then it would make it harder for the law abiding people to obtain protection or add to their collection they have grown as a harmless hobby. I think your rational for moving to avoid crime is a little bit of a fantasy. The last time I checked criminals are perfectly capable of obtaining a car or whatever to come to the "safe" neighborhoods that you are alluding to.

Please sir stop making yourself look like an ass by calling the subject "non-historical". It has every bit to do with history. As with my opening post and like every single new outlet has stated it, the overturn on the DC gun ban is a historical and monumental event in HISTORY. I get it the fact that you say you dont agree with guns. I'm not a gun fanatic and in fact i dont even own a gun. Im just a fan of our constitution and the rights that EVERYONE is entitled to as presented in it. A few posts ago (ya know the one where you were pretending to me and my financial situation) you failed to address or give me your thoughts on heller vs. DC. If you did i'm sorry that i failed to see it. Your thought pattern was erratic at best and I couldn't decipher what you were trying to convey because your post was so convoluted with BS. Please reply with rational arguments and I will cease the name calling and whatever else is hurting your feelings.

(ya know the one where you were pretending to me and my financial situation) Here is what i meant....(ya know the one where you were pretending to know me and my financial situation)...damn i have to edit my own damn self.

Brown wilson this is like pulling teeth with you two, can either one of you reply to posts I'm posting without avoiding things? Also go back and read properly what I wrote, where did I say I'd done a survey? And PLEASE DO answer me on this one. Also what is wrong with making the process or gun ownership more difficult? I have no problem whatsoever with the licensed gun enthusiast enjoying his, or her, hobby, however guns in certain places are very easily obtainable, you can't deny that. Also can you reply to the point I made about you feeling it necessary to protect your wife/property/home with a gun. Again you cannot deny that it would be nicer to live in an area where you didn't feel that was necessary. You said yourself you are a professional, did you not? You have no valid points to make, nor do you have a good argument against what I am saying.

"Also what is wrong with making the process or gun ownership more difficult?"...please go back and read where I said that making it more difficult would make it more easy for bad people to take advantage of people without proper protection by delaying the permit issuing process by adding more roadblocks. "Also go back and read properly what I wrote, where did I say I'd done a survey?"...simple you didn't you did a survey. It was rhetorical question posed to you much like the rhetorical question you posed to blee. "Also can you reply to the point I made about you feeling it necessary to protect your wife/property/home with a gun."...your solution seems to be to move. What if I simply dont have the means to buy a house but i'm fully able to legally purchase a pitol for 500 dollars? Please answer this. Where did ted bundy, jeff dahmer, BTK, the green river killer target their victims and live? not in the ghetto sir.

hairpie/brown wilson, this is like pulling teeth with you two. 1, where did I say I was against guns? I said I was for tighter gun control, you're putting words in my mouth, ANSWER PLEASE. 2, where did I mention your financial situation? I didn't say anything about your financial situation, you did - "I am a chemist at one of the governments largest manufacturers of weapons, so fuck off" is what you wrote. I was using what you wrote against yourself to indicate your level of intelligence, or rather lack of it. 3. This isn't a history conversation, as much as you try to swing it in that direction.It's a conversation about me wanting tighter gun controls and you two don't. You don't have a single valid reason for not doing - other than I should be allowed to protect my home, and then, by your own admission, you admit you don't even own a gun with which to protect your house with?! Who's full of BS now? Yes you, yet again!

"You said yourself you are a professional, did you not?"...i am and i did whats your point? what does a job have to do with where i choose to live? "You have no valid points to make, nor do you have a good argument against what I am saying."...it is YOUR opinion that i do not have any "valid points" to make but any reasonable person can at least see where i'm coming from. Why is that impossible for you? Are you not a reasonable person? I have had a rebuttal with every point that you have made. I'm not avoiding anything because you are not presenting anything. Your solution to living in harsh conditions is too move. Not only with me but you applied this logic to blee as well. If you review the case of heller vs. DC that is exactly what it is about. David Heller was a security guard and lived in a shitty area where he feared for his life. Was he supposed to move? Possibly leaving his job, his family, and his well being in general? What if he didn't have the means? What if he had kids too look after? He instead decided to fight for his rights to own a gun in the supreme court.

I mentioned what i did for a living NOT how much money i made doing it. YOU assumed that part by thinking i could just get up move my life to a different location. there shouldn't be anymore sanctions on gun control than there already are. its my right to own and shouldn't have to jump throught the flaming hoops that this government has already put in place. BTW I am planning on getting a gun in about 4-6 months FYI. Thats also why i'm stoked for this supreme court ruling.

hairpie/brown wilson, this is like pulling teeth with you two. 1, where did I say I was against guns? I said I was for tighter gun control, you're putting words in my mouth, ANSWER PLEASE. 2, where did I mention your financial situation? I didn't say anything about your financial situation, you did - "I am a chemist at one of the governments largest manufacturers of weapons, so fuck off" is what you wrote. I was using what you wrote against yourself to indicate your level of intelligence, or rather lack of it. 3. This isn't a history conversation, as much as you try to swing it in that direction.It's a conversation about me wanting tighter gun controls and you two don't. You don't have a single valid reason for not doing - other than I should be allowed to protect my home, and then, by your own admission, you admit you don't even own a gun with which to protect your house with?! Who's full of BS now? Yes you, yet again!

After just reading your last post, your argument for easier gun control is "Making it more difficult would make it more easy for bad people to take advantage of people without proper protection by delaying the permit issuing process by adding more roadblocks" This is your argument as to why gun control should be easier. OK, fine, name the top ten people you know who have had this happen to them whilst waiting on their gun permit. Should be easy enough for you should it not? After all this is the whole reason for your argument, right? Even more so seeing as you live so close to the very people you feel the need to protect yourself from? Again your words there, not mine. Your argument is weak and one that holds no water. Totally unrealistic. People might get attacked whilst waiting for their gun permit?! Listen to how stupid that sounds. You're barely trying to keep your head above water here. Grow up a bit, get some life experience behind you before spurting out such weak arguments as you are doing. This is verging on embarrassing. You make me look good though, this is too easy ; )

hairpie/brownwilson, which one of these would you like me to call you? If you are a professional one would assume you have a reasonable level of intelligence? Yes? Therefore why would anybody who considers themselves professional/intelligent choose to live in an area that they feel there is a need to protect themselves/wife/property etc with a gun? I've tried to ask you this several times but you don't give a good answer. You say you have a rebuttal for every point I make, yet the first point I tried to make, above, you avoid it at every opportunity?! You make the point about the security guard, and ask how, if you are poor, are you supposed to move to a better neighborhood? You however are not a security guard! You are "a professional at one of the governments leading etc etc" CORRECT?? You did say this? Yes you did. Is it not reasonable to think that with a certain level of success such as what you boast about, comes a certain level of financial security? If you are now saying you are actually quite poor I would suggest you are not actually as successful as you like to portray?! Using your example is actually, indirectly, arguing in favor of my case. And the point you liked to make about buying a gun in a few months. So fucking what. Why do you feel this is necessary for people to know that? I thought you were a successful professional, oh sorry no you're not, oh yes you are, er oh you're not?! Which exactly are you?

hairpie/brownwilson, which one of these would you like me to call you? If you are a professional one would assume you have a reasonable level of intelligence? Yes? Therefore why would anybody who considers themselves professional/intelligent choose to live in an area that they feel there is a need to protect themselves/wife/property etc with a gun? I've tried to ask you this several times but you don't give a good answer. You say you have a rebuttal for every point I make, yet the first point I tried to make, above, you avoid it at every opportunity?! You make the point about the security guard, and ask how, if you are poor, are you supposed to move to a better neighborhood? You however are not a security guard! You are "a professional at one of the governments leading etc etc" CORRECT?? You did say this? Yes you did. Is it not reasonable to think that with a certain level of success such as what you boast about, comes a certain level of financial security? If you are now saying you are actually quite poor I would suggest you are not actually as successful as you like to portray?! Using your example is actually, indirectly, arguing in favor of my case. And the point you liked to make about buying a gun in a few months. So fucking what. Why do you feel this is necessary for people to know that? I thought you were a successful professional, oh sorry no you're not, oh yes you are, er oh you're not?! Which exactly are you?

I dunno, I was taught to make bullets and shoot german lugars when I was 7. I dont trust the government, and am very happy knowing that when push comes to shove, at the least I can arm myself. I have no pre-conceived notions that the guns I could get together with my firends will stop anything the army has to oppress us, indeed, the second amendment evolved from Jefferson's desire to NOT have a standing army, and instead have local militias that every person (or man) would be part of to defend our country, NOT to insure that we could defend ourselves from *our* country. Given the current state of our government, though, I do appreciate peoples desire to arm themselves against it. I dont confuse the right to own a gun with the right for any wacko to get a gun quickly. I dont want people with psyco problems getting guns easily, anyone would be off their rocker to want quick and easy access to guns for everyone, we know the mentality and intelligence level of the general public. A waiting period is fine with me, and clearly not unconstitutional. Do I want the government as a gatekeeper, well, I defer to my educated population problem, if they were an educated responsible government, then yes, a government controlled by corporate interests, well, no. I think at a local level people can figure these things out for themselves, though. I dont lose sleep over the issue of gun control I guess, solve the bigger problems and these will work themselves out. I watch the issue pretty closely, though, as gun violence, any violence really, is an indicator to seeing the bigger issues at work. Ultimately, if a country is going to arm itself, it has an obligation to educate itself. As they say, guns dont kill people, people kill people. And more to the point, unresponsible, stupid, and un-dispilined people kill people. If we are going to let everyone be armed we had better make sure everyone is smart enough to use them responsibly, and our country falls very short, hence the frequency of the mass shootings that many other countries lack. One of my core philosophies is that education solves things, legislation is a poor band aid. Rather than outlawing guns to solve violence, make smarter people who have ample opportunity to achieve without violence. I find it ironic that most of the same people that are all for letting everyone have guns are also make fun of and belittle people for wanting to educate the population (taxes, they cry, you cant spend taxes educating people, even if they can get guns!), or give them opportunity to rise up in the community. Instead they want everyone armed and wont pay jack shit for the less fortunate, who ultimately then use guns to even the score. Great. I'll also take the person to task who says the left always turns to name calling, its a very tired talking point. I dare say I see the right wing turn to character assassination when the issues and facts are not in their favor far far more often. Ill point out the start of this conversation started with the right winger doing the name calling. Very immature, but hey, its what that mentality cultivates... ha. So, I dont really care either way, Im glad that people have the right to have guns, I just wish the pro-gun people would take their responsibility for educating the population they want armed more seriously. They sound very ignorant calling for less gun control, while bitching about helping people get out of poverty. Given the facts about murder rates between armed and unarmed countries its also very ironic when they are also against legal abortion...

Wow, me and Gabe actually agree on something! Fuck the right and left wing, they are two sides of the same coin regardless. I'm a voting Libertarian, a former member of the NRA, and owner of 5 guns. Besides, we're all going to need guns for the coming Zombie Apocalypse.

Wow, me and Gabe actually agree on something! Fuck the right and left wing, they are two sides of the same coin regardless. I'm a voting Libertarian, a former member of the NRA, and owner of 5 guns. Besides, we're all going to need guns for the coming Zombie Apocalypse.

In the constitution the right to bear arms not to protect just yourself but also our democracy If the government and criminals are the only ones to possess firearms them who stands in their way from turning our country into a socialist or even communist regime many liberals take a short view on world events and forget about history. they feel so safe and secure but if you look at it america is a baby of just over 200 years and many countries have come and gone take for instance rome which at the time no one ever predicted would fall. I feel more comfortable knowing i can defend not only myself and my family but also in the state of fluxuation the world is always in that myself and my fellow americans are armed. By the way history has to do with everything. Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it. I carry every day Erik

Jesmond..."Therefore why would anybody who considers themselves professional/intelligent choose to live in an area that they feel there is a need to protect themselves/wife/property etc with a gun?"...several factors to consider here. you seem to think that just because i'm a college educated professional that i'm raking in the big bucks. I really dont know where the assumtion that being a professional automatically rakes in the big bucks. I do ok but i could be doing alot better. you also have no idea where i'm at in my career i.e. starting out, mid career, etc. Success doesnt necessarily mean fat paychecks....its in the eye of the beholder. I can pay my monthly bills on time and afford to keep my wife, myself and my two dogs fed. i'm successful in my eyes. Ask gabe and i'm sure he'll tell you too that he's successful but wouldn't argue with you that he could use more money...i'm in the same boat THEREFORE i chose to live within my means and purchase a place that i could financially afford. I'm not poor by any means. Besides i could move to a "better" place and would still get a gun to protect my things. You are naive to think that running away from problems and crime is possible. crime is everywhere....ask sharon tate. Where was she when her fetus was cut out of her body by a bunch of WHITE GIRLS? To think that anyone, professional or not, can or should just up and move is rediculous. "OK, fine, name the top ten people you know who have had this happen to them whilst waiting on their gun permit. Should be easy enough for you should it not? After all this is the whole reason for your argument, right?"...Do you have the slightest concept of rhetorical yet completely possible situations? i'm sure this shit happens. I bet that situation doesn't happen often but some people have shitty luck and i'm sure it has happened before. "Your argument is weak and one that holds no water."...your opinion only. Im sure no one on this post takes your opinions as gospel. "Totally unrealistic."...again...your opinion. your also the guy who seems to think that crime has "boundries". Do you not believe that there are bad people everywhere willing to hurt you to get what they want? again refer to the sharon tate story "You're barely trying to keep your head above water here."...your inaccurate opinion of what is actually going on in th is debate. "Grow up a bit, get some life experience behind you before spurting out such weak arguments as you are doing."...last time i checked you dont know me one iota....my real name, age, the life i've lived in general, etc. i think its hilarious that you assume i'm a kid. from your assumption of me being young i'm assume that your old? if so maybe get a life and stop arguing with "kids" on this post. "This is verging on embarrassing."...must be very embarrasing for you old timer. "You make me look good though, this is too easy ; )"...thats probably impossible even for the best plastic surgeon in beverly hills. You have an over-inflated vision of yourself. Get off your high horse. You have run your mouth constantly on this post about "life experience". What is that exactly? Is it something that you get by merely being old? IF this is what your are referring to then i guess i could use a little more "life experien ce" to catch up to your high, yet seemingly unattainable, level of "life experience". OR is "life experience" actually living your life day to day and learning from everything that happens to you and dealing with odd or somewhat different situations? This definition of "life experience" has shaped my views on this issue. IF this is YOUR definition of "life experience" then i have a whole bunch of it....you simply have no idea. I dont mean that figuratively I mean that literally...you simply have no idea because you dont know the life i've lived up to this point SO my suggestion to you sir is to stop telling me, and anyone else, on this post that they need to stop being "immature", "grow up" and get some "life experience" just because they have a dissenting view of the world than you. Its very pompous and just a generally shitty attitude to direct towards others in life. What the fuck makes you so high and mighty?..apparen tly in your little world a different opinion than others around you. If you post again that i have not answered your questions about living where i live then i will liken talking to you to teaching a retard advanced calculus...you simply dont and wont get it. I have broken down your last post or two sentence by sentence and dont know what else i can do to answer as thoroughly as i possibly can. Erik...your the man. Its good to have company on this post. Gabe....i tend to agree with you on this issue for the most part. I am 100% positive that just making tighter gun regulations will not solve anything. When has legislation ever been more powerful then education? The answer is indeed education. I also agree that not all wackos and psycopaths deserve guns. My friends father was shot to death in broad daylight in a quiet residential neighborhood in front of his brothers' by schizophrenic who thought he was "after" him. Jesmond seems to believe that there are places to move that dont have crime.

BOB BARR!!...i'm a libertarian too. about gabe's poverty comment....i believe in personal responsibility. Granted there are certain situations (that i'm not going to discuss) when i'd more than willing to help a "houseless" person but i do not feel i should help the "houseless" person who is alcohol/ drugs addicted, living on the street, drowning in self pity not doing anything to help themselves. Believe it or not there are/ were people who are/ were in their shoes and decided to make their own way in life. This proves to me that its entirely possible to become something in life but those on streets choose to be there. Why should i have to pay taxes to help out that person when they choose not to help themselves? It sounds cruel to some but everyone is dealt their hand in life. Its up to that person to play it. Chris Gardner, the inspiration for the movie "Persuit of Happyness", is a prime example of what i'm talking about. Most rappers are too.

Hairpie/brownwilwson : You're talking endlessly without actually getting to a point. I'm not even going to bother arguing anymore with you because you are wearing blinkers. Saying, you have to deal with the hand that was dealt to you, is just another example of your utter drivel. What about the person who was run over by a drunk driver and is now a quadriplegic. You really believe they shouldn't be allowed any form of help and to "deal with it"?? What about injured/disabled Iraq war veterans? The very people your company supplies no less? They just have to "deal with it"????? Lets hope nothing like that ever happens to you or yours hey brownwilson? Otherwise then you'd have to just deal with it. Your statements and prose speak volumes about your personality (what personality you might ask). After reading your previous thread I can't honestly believe you're being serious. It's scary to think people like you actually exist. Your argument is weak and you contradict yourself continuously. On this one I'm just going to have to end it by saying we'll have to agree to disagree. And I'm right ; )

"i believe in personal responsibility. Granted there are certain situations (that i'm not going to discuss) when i'd more than willing to help"...guess you missed this part huh? those situations you described (disabled war vets and quadrapalegics) were the cases that i wasn't going to discuss. But hey if your cool with paying taxes to help people who dont want to help themselves (repeat drug addicts and alcoholics not willing to quit the habit) then i'm fine with that. you are a pompous person and no you are NOT right...far from it. I'm not saying i'm right either but i'm not wrong and wouldn't even necessarily say that you are wrong. Like you said agree to disagree and thanks for bowing out of this argument....really shows just how "right" you are.

Wow, I missed a lot since I've been gone. Erik - You are the man. History shapes how people live today and I'm glad someone agrees with that. Gabe - I agree pretty much with everything you said about guns. People should be educated.. and I do believe there are bigger issues and that they start in the nuclear family. However, just because I may not believe in paying higher taxes for public school, does not mean I don't agree with helping and educating people. In my opinion (and this is my opinion, not gospel), education is far better when it is private. Actually, the majority of parents in bad neighborhoods beg for private school vouchers and don't get them. I'll give you the reasons I think private schools are better. When you have publics, you have teachers on tenure. No matter how awful these teachers are, you can't get rid of them. The most you can do is transfer them and guess where the districts transfer them to? To the schools who do not do so well. So, most of these schools have awful teachers to start. I'm not saying that ALL of the teachers are bad, but I'm just saying there are a lot. And even if the school decided to get rid of these teachers, it costs around $250,000 because you have to give them a severance package. So, districts figure what's the point? If taxes were done away with for schools, people could take that money and instead put it towards private school, where there is competition for teachers, hence better quality teachers. We must start in baby steps tho, I'd be ecstatic if they just got rid of tenure all together and teachers had to work for their paycheck all the time. After all, it is our children's futures we are talking about. I'm not a right-winger either. I'm a Libertarian, hence my beliefs in personal responsibilty and privatization. I don't like Obama or McCain. I respect McCain for his service and dedication to this country, but do not agree with a lot of his policies. Jesmund - It doesn't even seem like you read any of what hairpie wrote. You say he talked endlessly without a point, but he made many points. Many of which was refuting what you said. I tend to agree that paying for frauds on disability (and I know of a couple), and lazy people who sit on their ass all day, when I'm out busting my ass 10 hours a day just to get by isn't exactly my cup of tea. I have no problem helping out people who are showing motivation, any veteran, senior citizens, etc.. people who actually contribute to society. I think the welfare system needs to be reformed to get people motivated to get jobs. It's way too easy right now to get on it and stay on it. Don't we want people to be successful? I believe in helping people, but you must first show initiative to want real help. Not a quick fix. As for the guns, you can't possibly believe that crime is only some parts of the country and not all around. BTK is a prime example of crime in a nice little suburban area. He attacked those who were his co-workers and neighbors all while leading another life. You always hear on the news that the killer was the guy next door and what do all his neighbors always say? "He was such a nice guy, I never thought he was like that." I actually had a guy who lived right near my high school who killed his wife, buried her in the wall, then killed himself. My friend used to babysit for them.. said "I never woulda guessed him to do that. He was such a nice guy." By the way, my neighborhood this happened in is a very good neighborhood. Crime rate is low, but it's still there...it's everywhere. You can never be too prepared for some to attack you. And me being a woman, would like to keep my right to defend myself because chances are that it will be a male who outweighs me as I am pretty small. I don't have a problem with background checks and waiting lists at all. They are actually very good for people who wish to commit crimes of passion. Gives them time to cool off, we hope at least. I'm sorry if I misconstrued you saying that you wanted to ban guns. I must have been confused because the first or second post you said something to the effect of "some people aren't responsible enough to own a gun let alone a car or be in society." That leads me to think you don't think guns should be legal. My mistake for jumping to conclusions. But I am all for agreeing to disagree, that's the beauty of this country.. being able to have different opinions and being able to openly debate them :)

Blee, ok I hear what you say. How about we say that both sides are probably right on some points? I think we'd all say fair enough to that, but you have to be honest - some people really aren't responsible enough to have a gun, you have to be honest back and say you understand where I am coming from on that? Maybe you don't agree with me on it, but you can understand that opinion?

jesmond even I agree with you on that point. When you said that there should be TIGHTER gun regs thats what i dont agree with because I believe that there are enough background checks and waiting lists in place. I mean you could apply for a permit today and not be able to buy a gun for at least a few weeks until the whole process is done. There are certainly alot of people out there who dont deserve a gun because they are medically or otherwise unstable people...no argument there. hahaha....but some people out of that lot somehow get ahold of guns and those are the people i'd like to defend myself against.

Jesmund - Yes, I do agree that some people are not responsible enough to have a gun. Some people aren't even responsible enough to have children, but they do. I just don't think you can resolve it by banning it. I do believe we should the keep the background checks and waiting lists we currently have. I don't think anyone should just be able to get a gun all willy nilly lol. I'm glad we were able to agree on something haha.