Talent

A short post about talent. Talent is the wish and desire to achive something so much that you are willing to give up almost everything else to get there! Its all about the learning and taking the time to practice practice and then more practice. Its so easy to go out with the guys at night...or sit and watch tv. Then Look at someone else and say...wow. What a god givin talent. BULLSHIT! Your short changing that person and NOT giving them the credit due for the sacrifices theyve made to achive what they have. I dont care if its a musician, artist, Tattooist, great car mechanic, surgeon etc. Its ALL about sacrifice. Those that give the most GET the most. Simple as that. Also...I may ad. Arn't those that put in more.....deserving of more? Don't try and short change a good artist or compare prices with the scratcher with the starter machine down the road.

Word man, but some people are born with talent, with the gift of creating. Some people in this industry are really good tattoo artist, but some others were born to do certain things. Ex: Albert Einstein, Michael Angel, Mozart, Diego Maradona. Not everyone can achieve the same results with the same amount of sacrifices.

I think your talking about 1/10 of 1/10 percent of the population. For all the rest of us its just plain hard work. To call it god given is almost a putdown. Talent is wanting to do something bad enough and persuing.

While you can be "born to do" something.... there's very little that I was "naturally good" at. Pretty much everything I've done has been becuase of hard work (and an ability to remember a lot of stuff.. lol). The same "Genius is one percent inspiration and ninety nine percent perspiration" thing, I guess. I've scheduled in two "drawing blocks of time" (three hours twice a week.. in addition to daily time) into my ridiculous fall schedule... hopefully out of that will come much better art.

Hey John: Regarding>"Talent is wanting to do something bad enough and persuing." I have to disagree with you. I don't think talent has anything to do with "wanting" or pursuing. (And read throughout before raising any flags!) Talent = possession of skills to achieve something beyond average. Dictionary's definition describes "Talent" as : Natural Aptitude or Skill. The fact that you may want something or pursue it will not make you a grant you Talent. There are many tattoo artists, musicians, painters, that don't have the talent of such after pursuing their career for years. Some individuals regardless how hard they try will not be talented in what they do. In most cases talent it is a God Given, you need to exploit that aptitude thru practice and dedication to discover the talent inside you. Again that doesn't mean that if you draw 23hrs a day for 10 years you will be a Michael Angelo. No señor.

I'll Agree and dissagree. I just think to many make a halfhearted attempt at something expecting the greatest results. You get out what you put in period. I just never subscribed to.....good enough. Thats the best way to end anything and everything. I'd just like to see a lot of these kids here who have shown some talent push a LOT harder. To many think theyve arrived and figure enough works been done when in fact if they would be more dedicated, study ALL aspects, cartooning, anatomy, color theory, lighting, reflective lighting, shadows, contrast etc. they would be well rounded and more able to pull off sucessfully what they invision. Im seeing way to many say Im good enough....let me at the machine! Go to the library...Hit the books.....stay home and practice practice practice. Better to mess up a piece of paper than your buddies hide!

JohnC I agree with you, and that's exactly what i said. Thru practice and dedication you will exploit the "TALENT" inside you. Let's be realistic out of 1000000000 professional basketball player there it will be ONLY ONE Michael Jordan... if so.

John, I personally believe in the 'you get out what you put in' concept and tend to agree with what you say about too many people who put minimum in and expect maximum back. I saw your art on another post and your workis fantastic and I doubt there are many ,if any, artist on this forum who could touch you with a paint brush. Your realism blows me away and I'm a 60 year old Tattoo Artist who can actually draw and used to oil paint years ago. I'm hard to impress but you definitely did it and did it well, thank you for posting your artwork. However, I don't think most of these youngsters are really willing to put in the time and dedication it takes to really excell at art (or much else for that matter) and as I suspect you know from reading other posts, know to be a huge part of the problem. Like you, I never was willing to be average or just good enough and worked my ass off to gain the skills I have acquired. I spend hours at the drawing board instead of being out partying (although I did do SOME of that, when I was younger and dumber) I really looked at and 'studied' the artwork that impressed me trying to figure out how they did that and worked at it 'til I could create the same effect. Sure it's a lot of work but when you see what it can do to others, it makes it all worthwhile, as I'm certain you know and agree. I personally think it's a 'product of the times' and could easily explain why there are so few true craftsmen anymore, they don't have the real drive and determination and we have a society that seems to accept medocrocy (sp?). Surely you have seen some of the pathetic crap some people try to pass off as art, especially when it comes to tattoos as well as some of the fantastic artwork some can produce. I don't get out much anymore but back when I did, I don't recall ever meeting or even hearing about any really talented Tattoo Artist who became a good or great artist 'overnight'. Yes, I'm 'old school' in that I have never understood how anyone could expect to be a good Tattoo Artist until they were first a good artist and I can't tell you how many people I've had ask me about apprenticing who had little or no artist ability (I've owned my own studio for 24 years) I don't know if you have followed any of the posts from people who send in their 'artwork' and get ballistic when their feeble attempts are shot down but if you saw it I KNOW you would agree that it's pitiful...Doc

Doc..LOVED the post. Im hoping more will read it. There ARE some kids here with talent and Im hoping they read and work thier asses off. Id love to see what they do a few years down the line.

After watching people work with infants I can pretty comfortably tell you that infants, and people, start off with the ability to speak any sound, and communicate in any language, visual, musical, etc, etc. By *not* practicing languages humans lose the ability to use those languages. Now, of course, some people have a natural inclinations to skills and what not, but everyone is capable of speaking/drawing/singing any language in the beginning... This American culture has certianly raised a generation of gimmi gimmi now now now poeple. Its not a very strong way to be... Too bad we didnt raise capable responsible hard working educated folks... ah well.

Talent.... man, I wish I had some. Great posts so far. I really hope everyone pops in and reads. Doc, agree (naturally) with pretty much everything you said. John, I agree with you as well, but I'm taking the position that you're born with a natural ability to do some things better than others. *an example* I seem to be lacking in the ability of the artistic nature. Which kinda sucks when you are attending an art school. I work my ass off on my drawings. Time will fly so fast, and next thing you know 5 hours have passed and I'm only 3/4 of the way finished. Even after all that time, my artwork sucks. I bust my ass at it, and it still sucks. I'm able to retain everything that I've been taught, and by all rights, I should be able to put it into practice (based on the practice your ass off stance) but even with all that practice and hard work, I produce mediocre at best stuff. That sucks, and is disheartening as all hell. But will I give up? Nah. I think somewhere I still have the idea that I'll eventually get better. It just happens to be taking forever. *sigh* Now that I'm done ranting about that.. I wanted to thank you again, John, for posting your wonderful artwork. And Doc, I like what you have on your myspace page. The chick with the tattoo gun is pretty cool.

this topic reminds me of an excellent article in Scientific American that I read a few days ago. It talks about how "geniouses" are made, not born. Here's a link to the article: http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&articleID=00010347-101C-14C1-8F9E83414B7F4945&pageNumber=4&catID=2 and here are some highlights" "Simon coined a psychological law of his own, the 10-year rule, which states that it takes approximately a decade of heavy labor to master any field. Even child prodigies, such as Gauss in mathematics, Mozart in music and Bobby Fischer in chess, must have made an equivalent effort, perhaps by starting earlier and working harder than others." "...Ericsson argues that what matters is not experience per se but "effortful study," which entails continually tackling challenges that lie just beyond one's competence. That is why it is possible for enthusiasts to spend tens of thousands of hours playing chess or golf or a musical instrument without ever advancing beyond the amateur level and why a properly trained student can overtake them in a relatively short time." "...Even the novice engages in effortful study at first, which is why beginners so often improve rapidly in playing golf, say, or in driving a car. But having reached an acceptable performance--for instance, keeping up with one's golf buddies or passing a driver's exam--most people relax. Their performance then becomes automatic and therefore impervious to further improvement. In contrast, experts-in-training keep the lid of their mind's box open all the time, so that they can inspect, criticize and augment its contents and thereby approach the standard set by leaders in their fields.

Gabe, as I said, I think most people nowadays want/expect things the easy way, which, incidently, I suspect is a major part of 'why' these 2 week 'tattoo schools' are around-pandering the fact. However, as we both know, there are still a dedicated few that are willing to work at it to excell and their work invariably shows that. You get around a lot of talented Tattoo Artist, have you ever met ANY who haven't worked at it for years to develope their art? Theval, personally, I think I have to agree that part of it may well be 'natural ability', something you're born with which makes it 'easier' for some to do some things very well. I've told folks for years that it's like having a seed, if you have one, water it, nourture it, really pay attention to it you can grow a beautiful plant but without that seed, all the water, fertilizer, great soil, etc., is not going to produce anything of beauty. I haven't seen enough of your artwork to know if it 'sucks' as you say or if perhaps you're being too hard on yourself. However, although I've never had any formal art classes in my life so I'm only going by what I've seen/heard (and some common sense) it could possibly be the particular school and/or instructors. That and the fact that I've seen that 'class room' instructions' don't always work the same for every 'student', some people need a little more 'personal' help to develope than others and most classes are not geared that way. I wish Daddy Rose would comment on this one, as it's certainly something he's knowledgeable about. If you want, email me some of your art and tell me where you think you need help (what you're having problems with), perhaps I can help. As to what you said about John's work, I obviously agree, it's beautiful, what else can you say? As to you liking what I've put up on myspace, Thank You, I try, thanks for taking the time to look...Doc

Theval, while it somehow got past me, my son noticed the 'tattoo gun' booboo, you KNOW better...Doc

I have read and re-read this post and have to agree that some are born with the ability to learn "faster" than others while some of us struggle. I have dedicated my life to the art (just recently) and have found that I am better a specific forms of art than others. For example, I am fascinated and highly admire the work of Jime Litwalk & Joe C. and love the style, color, and form they use but have some trouble drawing "outside" the box. If I layout some portraits and use graphite with what I have been taught....it flows and looks good but drawing in the "new skool" style I am utterly lost. So the feeling is although I am comfortable with one aspect I need to divuldge into another to get better. The idea that it takes ten years to "master" any form...well maybe. But again back to the fact some people learn their trade faster than others. I am a tattoo artist, with artist being the key. Yes I like the profession, yes I like the money (when it is around), but my mentor told me that it isn't ALL about the money...it is about the art! I agree 100%. If you force yourself to step outside the norm, challenge yourself to do something your not comfortable with, and devote yourself...you will get better. I have seen this over a short period of time in my work...although I throw away more than I save..I still draw 7 days a week, and some days spend 6-8 hours drawing (I devote at least 2 hours every day). Just my two cents.... Mike

You won't discover your talent until you try hard to expose it. Again not everyone will be able to expose the same degree of talent with the same amount of effort.

That was an excellent article from Scientific American - thanks for posting that one. it made me think of this quote: "What you mean by a good player is the man whose eye and muscles and nerves have been so trained by making innumerable good shots that they can now be relied on. They have a certain tone or quality which is there even when he is not playing, just as a mathematician’s mind has a certain habit and outlook which is there even when he is not doing mathematics" -- to me, when I get THERE.. to be an 'artist' rather than doing art... I'll feel like I've accomplished something.

Shit.... *drops and gives Doc 20 pushups* I can't believe I did that. I truly feel like a jackass. You're right. I really should know better by now. Sheesh. *hangs head in shame*

In response to Emge, I believe that unless you make the all too common mistake of settling, you are never 'there" as you put it. You hear the old timers , and especially the newbies, talk about how you never know it all , there's always more you can learn, and you can always better yourself. I also believe that it's through this sort of thinking that artists and hell people in general are able to rise above mediocrity and place new standards in what's considered great and even acceptable artwork. Just by looking at a even a brief history of tattoos you can see how artists with this mind frame have pushed the envelope further and further. The boldness and realism that these people have achieved in skin art, was most likely more drive and desire than what people would call talent. So I guess talent is a direct reflection of one's imagination put to work. If y ou see yourself wanting to accomplish new and great things and have the determination to do it , eventually you'll come up with the proper equation. And you end up with the artwork like we have available to us today in the tattoo industry, realistic portraits, bright bold colors, art like the world's never seen on breathing canvas before. Because these men and women creating these masterpieces that are admired by the world, have never made it "there" and probably never will.

with passion you can do anything. not having talent makes it harder with talent you have a gift, but without passion it's worthless

I suppose I should clarify what I meant by being "there" as an artist. It wasn't to settle, really. I see how my post could have been taken as that. More so what I meant was... if I can see a quality in my work, a "tone" to everything I do.. the fact that by constant training I rely upon my skills to perform whatever task I put before them.. Then I will be confident enough to put greater and greater challenges to myself, knowing that I am capable enough to accomplish it.